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IDProjectCategoryView StatusDate SubmittedLast Update
0004025Dwarf FortressWorld Generation -- Generalpublic2011-02-18 22:362012-11-27 18:15
ReporterSirPenguin Assigned ToToady One  
PrioritynormalSeveritymajorReproducibilityalways
Status resolvedResolutionfixed 
Product Version0.31.19 
Fixed in Version0.34.03 
Summary0004025: Kobolds still starving to death early in world gen
DescriptionLooking over Legends mode, I'm seeing many cases such as this: http://i.imgur.com/LGusr.png

It doesn't matter if the kobold was born year 0 or year 3, they all die in year 4, all of starvation. Looking over Legends it appears that some dwarves and elves suffer from this as well, but as it stands right now not a single kobold makes it to the end of world gen.
Steps To ReproduceGenerate a world and look over Legends mode
Additional InformationTried with 3 different worlds of varying size
Tags0.31.21, civilization, food, legends

Relationships

related to 0004046 resolvedToady One All/Most intelligent creatures are dead. 
related to 0007025 new Kobold civilizations have low life expectency 

Activities

janglur

2011-02-19 23:58

reporter   ~0015295

I can confirm. Year varies but it always under 5.

Infiltrator

2011-02-24 10:34

reporter   ~0015455

Whole bunch of dead kobolds at about year 4, yeah.

I'm listening to the DFT now, and Toady mentioned earlier that goblins don't actually eat food. I'm guessing that it's just an oversight where golbins and kobolds and all them don't produce food, but kobolds still eat it, therefore starving to death in short order.

Just checked legends; it says the cause of death is starving, so I'd say that's what's happening. Eating but not making food.

Heinzy

2011-03-01 06:11

reporter   ~0015626

I can confirm this, but also add that I've seen a number of worlds that most of the pop starved to death. Most notably was the elves that tended to live for a long time but then suddenly died around the year that the world gen stopped.

Captain Mayday

2011-03-12 16:55

reporter   ~0016174

Getting something similar with megabeasts. They all seem to starve if they take over a civ. World entered the age of heroes real fast.

Malibu Stacey

2011-03-14 10:39

reporter   ~0016240

Last edited: 2011-03-14 10:40

 Goblins had [NO_EAT] added as of 0.31.19 to their entity in creature_standard.txt hence they're not being affected (there are some beasts also with the tag like magma men, iron men etc).

As far as food generation goes, in entity_default.txt the Skulking (Kobold) & Forest (Elf) civilizations only have [PERMITTED_JOB:HERBALIST]. Humans & Dwarves also have [PERMITTED_JOB:PLANTER]. Humans, Dwarves & Goblins also have[PERMITTED_JOB:BUTCHER]

I think Elves may be surviving for longer as the forests they set up in have more plant life to allow plant gathering to generate enough food to sustain their populations where as Kobolds live in caves where it's not viable to live off foraging alone.

Until creatures/civilizations get some way to acquire food through non-production means (theft, trade etc) I would try adding [PERMITTED_JOB:BUTCHER] and/or [PERMITTED_JOB:PLANTER] to the Skulking civilization in entity_default.txt & see if they survive longer (or go for the easy way out & add [NO_EAT] to them in creature_standard.txt) & vice-versa for the Forest civilization.

Doradan

2011-03-18 15:29

reporter   ~0016359

(.31.21) All kobolds are gone from the map in a matter of years, while goblins and humans (usually in the same civ) are practically everywhere except islands. Tried at least half a dozen worldgens, wondering if they just got unlucky with a bronze colossus or something, but they just keep dying out.

Kumquat

2011-04-09 05:33

reporter   ~0017222

Most dwarfs seem to be dead by year 10 in world gen due to starvation.

I guess this may be because mountain biomes do not allow planting...

InsanityPrelude

2011-04-26 17:48

reporter   ~0017537

Last edited: 2011-04-26 17:49

 The other civs make it through world gen just fine (although I only gen to about 250 years, so I may just not be running it long enough,) but I haven't had kobolds in a while. I'd been assuming one of the Civ Forge races wiped them out...

user11

2011-06-09 18:13

  ~0017961

Possibly fixed in next version (may or may not be 31.26) - per Dev Notes on 06/09/2011:
"I also put in some extra precautions and tweaks so that dwarves form markets properly and are more survivable in world gen. Kobolds as well."

SirPenguin

2012-02-15 21:39

reporter   ~0019742

I don't think this was fixed, per se. It looks more that the "protection" kobolds and co. receive is that the starvation counter begins at year 20 instead of year 0. Perhaps this is meant to give kobolds long enough time to establish food stores, but I'm still finding that entire kobold sites die anywhere from years 24-27

Kumquat

2012-02-15 23:26

reporter   ~0019745

Looking at legends, all historical kobolds appear to die from starvation about 3 years after they become historical.

DarthCloakedDwarf

2012-02-15 23:46

reporter   ~0019747

After 250 years of history, my adventurer has repeatedly been accosted by kobolds. It seems this bug is no longer present in the new version.

user6

2012-02-16 07:01

  ~0019784

Reminder sent to: Kumquat, SirPenguin

Since it appears that this no longer happens in every world, it might help if you provided seeds for worlds where kobolds died out early.

SirPenguin

2012-02-28 19:35

reporter   ~0020887

So, definitely fixed now because he removed starvation

user6

2012-02-28 19:59

  ~0020889

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=103007.msg3044588#msg3044588

Historical figures does not include entity populations, so this may still be an issue.

user11

2012-03-07 17:57

  ~0021241

I think the particular changes in 34.03 pretty much resolved the intent of this bug report without reading more into it.

If anyone is finding their populations depleting (not historical figures in legends) because of what seems like unnecessary starvation from famine, please open a new issue, or if you feel you have something to add to this report, please PM a manager on the forums.

Issue History

Date Modified Username Field Change
2011-02-18 22:36 SirPenguin New Issue
2011-02-19 23:58 janglur Note Added: 0015295
2011-02-21 09:06 user11 Relationship added related to 0004046
2011-02-24 10:34 Infiltrator Note Added: 0015455
2011-03-01 06:11 Heinzy Note Added: 0015626
2011-03-10 08:12 AO Tag Attached: 0.31.21
2011-03-10 08:12 AO Tag Attached: civilization
2011-03-10 08:12 AO Tag Attached: food
2011-03-10 08:12 AO Tag Attached: legends
2011-03-12 16:55 Captain Mayday Note Added: 0016174
2011-03-14 10:39 Malibu Stacey Note Added: 0016240
2011-03-14 10:40 Malibu Stacey Note Edited: 0016240
2011-03-18 15:29 Doradan Note Added: 0016359
2011-04-09 05:33 Kumquat Note Added: 0017222
2011-04-26 17:48 InsanityPrelude Note Added: 0017537
2011-04-26 17:49 InsanityPrelude Note Edited: 0017537
2011-06-09 18:12 user11 Tag Attached: Fixed in 31.26?
2011-06-09 18:13 user11 Note Added: 0017961
2011-06-09 18:14 user11 Tag Detached: Fixed in 31.26?
2011-06-09 18:14 user11 Tag Attached: Fixed in 0.31.26?
2012-02-14 05:12 user6 Tag Renamed Fixed in 0.31.26? => Fixed in 0.34.01?
2012-02-15 21:39 SirPenguin Note Added: 0019742
2012-02-15 23:26 Kumquat Note Added: 0019745
2012-02-15 23:46 DarthCloakedDwarf Note Added: 0019747
2012-02-16 07:01 user6 Note Added: 0019784
2012-02-16 07:01 user6 Summary Every kobold starves to death at exactly year 4 in world gen => Kobolds still starving to death early in world gen
2012-02-28 19:35 SirPenguin Note Added: 0020887
2012-02-28 19:59 user6 Note Added: 0020889
2012-03-07 17:54 user11 Tag Detached: Fixed in 0.34.01?
2012-03-07 17:57 user11 Note Added: 0021241
2012-03-07 17:57 user11 Status new => resolved
2012-03-07 17:57 user11 Fixed in Version => 0.34.03
2012-03-07 17:57 user11 Resolution open => fixed
2012-03-07 17:57 user11 Assigned To => user11
2012-03-07 17:58 user11 Status resolved => assigned
2012-03-07 17:58 user11 Assigned To user11 => Toady One
2012-03-07 17:58 user11 Status assigned => resolved
2014-07-10 23:08 user6 Relationship added related to 0007025