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IDProjectCategoryView StatusDate SubmittedLast Update
0000231Dwarf FortressDwarf Mode -- Buildings, Generalpublic2010-04-02 20:462012-11-27 18:18
Reporteroliver Assigned ToToady One  
PrioritynormalSeveritymajorReproducibilityalways
Status resolvedResolutionfixed 
Fixed in Version0.34.06 
Summary0000231: Body parts from large creatures (bones, meat, leather, tusks, etc) slow workshops down due to clutter
DescriptionWhen slaughtering something large, like an elephant, you get a huge stack of bones - I get around 60 per elephant.

When a bone carver then tries to do something with this big stack, he will bring the whole stack to the workshop. This is enough to instantly make the workshop heavily cluttered.

This, combined with the new behaviour where one job only processes 1 bone, not the whole stack, means that making anything from a large creature's bones is very very slow compared to the equivalent if you used bones from smaller creatures.
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Edit: As noted in 0001603, the behaviour is also experienced for elephant meat and fat.
Tagsbones, workshop

Relationships

related to 0000808 resolvedToady One Processing Raw Turtles only makes one shell per stack, and other stack size issues 
has duplicate 0001238 resolveduser6 Labors taking too long / auto-clutter 
has duplicate 0001489 resolvedLogical2u Super clutter with one elephant tusk 
has duplicate 0001603 closedLogical2u giant stacks of elephant bones/fat instantly clutter kitchens or workshops, making work extremely slow. 
has duplicate 0004202 resolvedLogical2u Large stacks of bones cause ungodly clutter in workshops 
has duplicate 0004341 resolveduser6 Some animal byproducts overclutter anything they placed in. 
has duplicate 0004418 resolveduser6 Clutter from wool, sheared from one animal 
has duplicate 0004465 resolveduser6 Single hides clutter tanners shop causing slow reactions 
has duplicate 0004800 resolveduser1294 One yak skull (perhaps others) clutters crafter's shop to *CLT* 

Activities

Ymrel

2010-04-02 21:06

reporter   ~0000412

Not sure if this qualifies as a bug. From a realism standpoint, it should take longer to carve many bones as compared to a few bones. Taking the entire stack at once might be a problem, but I'm not sure if it's a "bug".

oliver

2010-04-02 21:28

reporter   ~0000420

The problem is that it's not taking a long time to carve a big stack; it's taking a long time to carve a single bone from a big stack. Each job only processes 1 bone, and is much slower than an equivalent job processing 1 bone from a smaller stack.

DoctorZuber

2010-04-02 23:16

reporter   ~0000436

soo...
60 bones
Worker hauls all 60 bones
crafting shop becomes instantly cluttered

so crafting arrows, trade goods, whatever, is therefore done at a highly reduced rate simply because of the quirk of haulers bringing a full stack at once on you.

While I agree this sounds annoying, I would not classify this as a major issue.

Ampersand

2010-04-03 00:15

reporter   ~0000445

Bone stacks probably ought to be divided into easier to digest stacks. This probably is a bug, just from noting a lot of the other hauling related bugs, so I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss it.

GauHelldragon

2010-04-03 16:12

reporter   ~0000703

I've had the same clutter problem with even a single skull or tusk of an elephant. The butchery shop remains ultra cluttered with 1 item of elephant cartillage.

Speaking of elephant bone bolts... the huge stacks that clutter up the workshop only seem to result in 5 bone bolts :P

Von Krieger

2010-04-19 15:34

reporter   ~0004272

Yeah, elephant tusks, skulls, heck even an elephant eyeball will clutter up a workshop.

random51

2010-04-28 06:22

reporter   ~0005514

You think elephants are bad, try this with a jabberer.

Any jabberer item puts a workshop at max clutter.

greycat

2010-08-03 08:50

reporter   ~0011442

A Draltha tooth or skull also clutters the workshop, all by itself. Not max clutter, but red. Even though the tooth is listed as weighing "<1Gamma".

Apparently there's some sort of flag attached to these items, independent of their weight, which makes them act unreasonably when they're in workshops.

RedKing

2011-03-26 05:39

reporter   ~0016632

I can confirm that this behavior occurs with dralthas and yaks. One yak cow skull has my craftsdwarf shop at max clutter.

Blah

2011-03-28 01:07

reporter   ~0016707

Last edited: 2011-03-28 01:11

 Also occurs with a Stray Yak Calf Skin. A single one is enough to (CLT) my Tanner's Workshop.

Doesn't occur with Stray Alpaca Skin, Stray Goat Skin.

Xelanthol

2011-03-28 06:45

reporter   ~0016716

Yeah this is frustrating-I would appreciate a look at this in the next bug fix. :3

Rhenaya

2011-04-02 14:47

reporter   ~0016992

i noticed that yak stuff is in general prone to clutter everything

i am currently making bone bolts on several workshops, they are all kept tidy so only the work material is in them and still i get something like that:

yak bull bone (3) -> *clt*
giant badger bone (14) -> (clt)
stray horse foal bone (13) -> (clt)

so 3 yak bull bones seem to clutter a workshop more than 5 times giant badger ones

kwieland

2011-04-09 10:04

reporter   ~0017241

A single buffalo hair, 8 weight, causes extreme clutter in a farmer's workshop.

Immacolata

2011-04-17 00:58

reporter   ~0017410

Last edited: 2011-04-27 00:11

 Stray horse bones do the same in 31.25 - bones from one Stray horse (8 it seems) in my Craftdwarfs workshop causes purple *CLT*. http://postimage.org/image/1hswu68x0/

Ratalon

2011-05-14 20:17

reporter   ~0017729

31.25 - The single Stray Yak Skull being made into a totem = purple clutter.

afftor

2011-06-27 14:34

reporter   ~0018056

This bug makes all butcher related skills (bonecarve, tanning, cooking etc) quite annoying to use. I hope at least this gonna be fixed some day.

foxbyte

2012-02-17 11:47

reporter   ~0019949

As of 34.01 this bug is still present.

janglur

2012-02-21 10:02

reporter   ~0020390

Still present and rather disruptive

kingpeonidas

2012-02-22 12:50

reporter   ~0020478

Last edited: 2012-02-22 13:08

 This could be easily fixed by having clutter calculations ignore one item (or stack), of which being any largest item in the shop at a given time. One big thing doesnt cause clutter, its just there, the other things are what keep you from working with the one large item (or stack), they are the clutter. It would be understandable that byproducts could be a clutter causing thing although unrepresented in item or inventory in the game, so some additional calculation although less severe could be added only encompassing the size of the largest item (or stack), for instance clutter for item 1 being (c = sqrt(s)*m) (clutter = squareroot of size multiplied by a coefficient (m)). this would allow the largest item (or stack) to only have a clutter effect much less severe while still paving the road for some penalty for manufacturing using T-Rex bones.

The final equation for clutter would end up being (c = (sqrt(s1)*m) + s2*m)
clutter = root of largest item (or stack) times coefficient added to the result of size of all other items multiplied by coefficient.

Or a more computationally friendly equation would instead of using a square root which would prevent issues with unforseen updates with incredibly large boned creature, would be to simply divide by a factor the first size. I perceive this method although less computationally intensive is merely a band-aid solution instead of the one change fix all method above in the sqrt equation.
EX. (c = s1*m/4) + s2*m)

LEGEND c=clutter, s1= size of largest item/stack, s2= size of all items stored not including s1, m= coefficient for clutter calculation.

Alternatively this could be introduced not in the clutter calculation at all, but instead in the workshop's inventory by detecting the largest item in the inventory each time the contents change and spoofing a rooted value of the size to be reported to the inventory itself temporarily until that item is removed which the liberty would then be passed upon the next smallest item, or another larger one is introduced removing liberty and passing it up to the new candidate for rooted size reporting. The addition of a boolean value to the objects tracked could keep record of the item with a spoofed size to indicate necessity to be squared before it is removed from the workshops inventory, and be squared when viewed as a single item through description.

Qmarx

2012-02-23 11:45

reporter   ~0020561

Yeah, two panda skulls puts my butcher shop in the red. How clutter looks at sizes needs to be reworked.

afftor

2012-02-24 12:58

reporter   ~0020618

I like how this issue is not even acknowledged yet.

kingpeonidas

2012-02-27 15:05

reporter   ~0020803

Last edited: 2012-02-27 15:07

 agreed afftor.

mabye there should be a workshop resize option so you can make a 4x7 bone carver if you deployed in a elephant rich area.

etherflan

2012-02-27 23:52

reporter   ~0020828

Last edited: 2012-02-27 23:56

 I think this bugtracker needs a duplicate mark because "resolved" is kind of confusing to navigate.
If you look at the actual report you see that resolution = duplicate. Oh well.
From what I understand this is now the main bug report?

user6

2012-02-28 06:28

  ~0020835

Use the "Manage Columns" page to make the resolution show up on the bug list page: http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/account_manage_columns_page.php

Issue History

Date Modified Username Field Change
2010-04-02 20:46 oliver New Issue
2010-04-02 21:06 Ymrel Note Added: 0000412
2010-04-02 21:28 oliver Note Added: 0000420
2010-04-02 21:39 clamity Tag Attached: bones
2010-04-02 21:39 clamity Tag Attached: workshop
2010-04-02 23:16 DoctorZuber Note Added: 0000436
2010-04-03 00:15 Ampersand Note Added: 0000445
2010-04-03 16:12 GauHelldragon Note Added: 0000703
2010-04-16 10:09 user6 Relationship added parent of 0001238
2010-04-19 15:34 Von Krieger Note Added: 0004272
2010-04-24 11:03 user6 Relationship added parent of 0001489
2010-04-28 04:39 Logical2u Relationship added has duplicate 0001603
2010-04-28 04:43 Logical2u Summary Bone stacks from large creatures slow workshops right down => Bone, food stacks from large creatures slow workshops right down
2010-04-28 04:43 Logical2u Description Updated
2010-04-28 04:44 Logical2u Summary Bone, food stacks from large creatures slow workshops right down => Bone, food stacks from large creatures slows workshops down due to clutter
2010-04-28 06:22 random51 Note Added: 0005514
2010-04-28 13:58 user6 Category General => Dwarf Mode -- Buildings, General
2010-06-22 09:05 user6 Relationship replaced has duplicate 0001238
2010-06-22 09:05 user6 Relationship added related to 0000808
2010-08-03 08:50 greycat Note Added: 0011442
2011-03-12 09:39 Logical2u Relationship added has duplicate 0004202
2011-03-25 13:26 user6 Relationship added has duplicate 0004341
2011-03-26 05:39 RedKing Note Added: 0016632
2011-03-28 01:07 Blah Note Added: 0016707
2011-03-28 01:11 Blah Note Edited: 0016707
2011-03-28 01:11 Blah Note Edited: 0016707
2011-03-28 06:45 Xelanthol Note Added: 0016716
2011-04-01 12:40 user6 Relationship added has duplicate 0004418
2011-04-02 14:47 Rhenaya Note Added: 0016992
2011-04-07 11:30 Logical2u Relationship added parent of 0004465
2011-04-07 11:37 user6 Summary Bone, food stacks from large creatures slows workshops down due to clutter => Stacks of body parts from large creatures (bone, meat, leather, etc) slow workshops down due to clutter
2011-04-07 11:38 user6 Relationship replaced has duplicate 0004465
2011-04-07 12:09 Logical2u Relationship replaced has duplicate 0001489
2011-04-07 12:09 Logical2u Summary Stacks of body parts from large creatures (bone, meat, leather, etc) slow workshops down due to clutter => Body parts from large creatures (bones, meat, leather, tusks, etc) slow workshops down due to clutter
2011-04-09 10:04 kwieland Note Added: 0017241
2011-04-17 00:58 Immacolata Note Added: 0017410
2011-04-17 01:00 Immacolata Note Edited: 0017410
2011-04-27 00:11 Immacolata Note Edited: 0017410
2011-05-14 20:17 Ratalon Note Added: 0017729
2011-06-27 14:34 afftor Note Added: 0018056
2011-08-03 08:24 user1294 Relationship added has duplicate 0004800
2012-02-17 11:47 foxbyte Note Added: 0019949
2012-02-17 12:13 user6 Sticky Issue No => Yes
2012-02-21 10:02 janglur Note Added: 0020390
2012-02-22 12:50 kingpeonidas Note Added: 0020478
2012-02-22 12:53 kingpeonidas Note Edited: 0020478
2012-02-22 12:56 kingpeonidas Note Edited: 0020478
2012-02-22 13:00 kingpeonidas Note Edited: 0020478
2012-02-22 13:00 kingpeonidas Note Edited: 0020478
2012-02-22 13:01 kingpeonidas Note Edited: 0020478
2012-02-22 13:01 kingpeonidas Note Edited: 0020478
2012-02-22 13:05 kingpeonidas Note Edited: 0020478
2012-02-22 13:08 kingpeonidas Note Edited: 0020478
2012-02-23 11:45 Qmarx Note Added: 0020561
2012-02-24 12:58 afftor Note Added: 0020618
2012-02-27 15:05 kingpeonidas Note Added: 0020803
2012-02-27 15:07 kingpeonidas Note Edited: 0020803
2012-02-27 23:52 etherflan Note Added: 0020828
2012-02-27 23:54 etherflan Note Edited: 0020828
2012-02-27 23:56 etherflan Note Edited: 0020828
2012-02-28 06:28 user6 Note Added: 0020835
2012-03-14 03:58 Toady One Status new => resolved
2012-03-14 03:58 Toady One Fixed in Version => Next Version
2012-03-14 03:58 Toady One Resolution open => fixed
2012-03-14 03:58 Toady One Assigned To => Toady One
2012-03-15 13:02 user6 Sticky Issue Yes => No